text🌻seeking legal advice

[multidisciplinary]

Type: Text (backdated to before Farplane event)
Sender ID: Anonymous
To: Public
Subject: Seeking legal advice
Warnings: None

--

Hello.

I am in need of legal advice regarding a private matter:

Is a marriage contract legally binding if one or more parties involved were under the influence of spiritual possession while it was officiated?

Thank you for your assistance.

Comments

[empyrean_mirror]

I'm not a lawyer but I've heard that ghost marriages are technically legally binding?

But if it's fairly recent you should be able to get an anullment.

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

Do you mean binding for the spirits themselves or binding for the living stand-ins? Please be as exact as possible.

voice; i'm sorry she doesn't know how to use a phone; un: desirestruth

[desirestruth]

...Yes.

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ Normally, Zelda would change formats to make things easier for someone who isn't tech savvy, but doing so would defeat the purpose of remaining anonymous.

Especially because that answer is.... worrying. ]

May I ask your source? A precise citation would be most helpful.

[TEXT]

[onebullet]

No.

[ She doesn't mince words... but there's a follow-up after a couple of minutes. ]

If things work similarly to where I'm from, it's void due to lack of consent.

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ Straight and to the point is appreciated. ]

That was not the case here. Myself and my [ what even is darin to her now??? ] companion for the evening gave our consent for the spirits to borrow our bodies to facilitate their union.

text; un: catsgothistongue

[catsgothistongue]

[If there's anyone who knows about ghosts and marriages (not together mind you but you get what you get), it's Ranma, much to his chagrin. Hi Zelda, here's your local chaos gremlin.]

Was it done in yours and the other's name, or whoever was possessing you's? Cause if it's in someone else's name, then I don't think that counts... Though most of the weddings where I'm from typically don't involve written contracts, so take this with a grain of salt.

... If they try to say otherwise though, you could always beat them up. That always renders it null and void when you win in my experience!

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ ... Ranma what kind of advice is this. ]

My companion and I provided the spirits' names, as they were the ones who wanted to wed. But they required physical forms in order to stand before a minister.



[ And then, after a minute of clear hesitation: ]

Exactly who do you suggest that I "beat up?"

text;

[thearchangel]

I doubt it.

Even if it were, it'd be easy to get it annulled. Just cite "under the influence". If it works for drunks, it works for uh.



Can't believe I'm saying this: Ghosts.

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ Zelda has just a small panic attack when she sees a message from Garrus before she remembers that she's posting this anonymously. (Can't let the future second in command know that the captain might've gotten married Vegas-style....) ]

"Under the influence?" As in, intoxicated?

TEXT | UN: hammertime

[forgeabettertomorrow]

[Darin, naturally, has not learned how to respond to things anonymously.]

Wait this happened to someone else too?! They really gotta put some disclaimers out there or something.

not here;

[headhunt]

( ➢ track thread
➢ select ! ✓ )

[not here]

[thearchangel]

[METAL GEAR "!" NOISE HERE]

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ DARIN NO WHAT ARE YOU DOING HERE



Okay, just. Stay calm, Zelda. Remember, you're writing this anonymously. It's fine.

Maybe he'll have something helpful to say. It's not as though they've talked much about this whole marriage thing. Their attention has been... elsewhere. ]

A warning certainly would have been helpful.



[ Then, several long and awkward seconds later: ]

What do you intend to do?

un; themightynappa [Voice]

[minorinpain]

Why you makin' this so complicated? [Vegeta's a drama queen too. Must be a royal thing. Thank the Kais Nappa's such an everyman.]

The hell do ghosts gotta do with it? If you wanna be married to the guy, you're married to him. If you DON'T wanna be married to the guy, you ain't. Was anyone gonna know differently before you said anything about it?

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ It is, in fact, a royal thing.

But also Vegeta's a drama queen. ]

I am not an expert in law [ actually she is ] but I don't believe I can simply say that I am unmarried if a legal registry says that I am.

text // user: headhunt

[headhunt]

ONLY IF YOU CONSUMMATED THE MARRIAGE

BED THE OTHER PERSON IF YOU WANNA KEEP THEM

SHOW THEM WHO YOU ARE!!!!!

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ ... Why does it feel like this person is yelling? Is their shellphone stuck in capslock?

This is very aggressive advice... ]

Unless the definition of "consummation" here differs from the one in my world, then no, the marriage has not been consummated.

[ If one reads carefully, one might find that, although Anonymous did not make it to home base with their maybe-spouse, they may have rounded one or two bases. ]

text: un; gruffier

[gruffier]

[ ...

Well. That was a new one. ]

First I've heard of anything like that. Are you saying the marriage was not consensual?

[multidisciplinary]

No, the marriage between the spirits was consensual, and my companion and I also consented to host them within our bodies in order to facilitate the union. And therein lies the problem- a marriage contract binds soul and body.

text | un: netherese

[netherese]

Well, these things can certainly get a bit dodgy when there are spirits involved, but I suppose I can guess roughly when this might have happened.

There is, of course, the matter of consent; regardless of whether or not your bodies were taken forcefully, there is a difference between the hosts exchanging vows and the spirits. The line is a touch blurry, I'll admit, but if there was no token of affection exchanged or registration with a magister of some sort, I hardly think it counts.

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ Zelda thinks back to the iron-and-rose rings that Darin fashioned for the two spirits to exchange with each other during the ceremony. ]









Suppose there were tokens exchanged...

[octoblot]

[HELLO DID SOMEONE SAY CONTRACTS--oh wait, it's a marriage contract. Not his favorite kind to talk about, but still--]

It can depend on multiple factors based on how the contract was written, at least for marriage licenses. Did you consent to this possession, or was the decision made under duress? If it's the latter, then the marriage license is often thrown out if one or both applicants are judged to have not been "sound of mind" at the time.

Secondly, did you use your actual name, or did the spirits use their names? Did you sign any documents with your dominant hand? If a couple provides false information, and/or signs any marriage documentation with the wrong hand, the license is also invalidated as it's considered a case of fraud.

Finally, age of consent is a factor: If one or both applicants are under 18, they may need consent from a parent or guardian. If one or both applicants are under 15, you would normally need a court order, so this is an argument that can also be helpful if the spirits... or ah, you and this other person, are not actually in the typical age range for marriage, though I have yet to learn what exactly is considered proper marriage age in this place yet.

Text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ FINALLY!! Now this is the kind of answer Zelda has been looking for. Thank you, contract-savvy stranger. ]

Thank you, this is most helpful! Let me answer your questions.

1. We did not consent to the possession on the outset, but after some discussion, we did consent during the marriage ceremony.

2. We gave the spirits' names.

3. We were not required to sign any forms. I am of the impression that the Naughtilust only requires verbal agreement in the case of marriage agreements.

4. I am also unclear of the legal marriageable age on the Naughtilust. My companion and I are both over the age of eighteen, and I believe both spirits were as well before they died.

[ Be straight with her: on a scale of 1 to 10, how legally married is she? ]

Text / un; Enterprise

[lucky_e]

I wouldn't think so? It sounds like a wedding that happened while one or both parties were inebriated.

Text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

You are the second person to mention that intoxication as a viable reason to render a marriage void. Why is that? Do laws not apply to intoxicated individuals in your world?

text | un: astudyinviolet

[astudyinviolet]

I could think of a few reasons why it would not, but upon reviewing some of the other responses here, the easiest would be to say that you were the wedding clothing for the spirits to wear. I highly doubt anyone would say that the dress and suit worn during a wedding are now married to each other.

[ A second text follows quickly. ]

Or two dresses or two suits.

Text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

I was the wedding gown?

[ Sherlock, that's






Okay you might be onto something there. ]

I suppose that is accurate


in a manner.

text; un: deepstar

[deepstar]

I have many questions I'm dying to ask here.

Someone else broke it down way better than I could. If I were you, I'd read over carefully what they had to say. Honestly, it doesn't sound like you have anything to worry about here.

Text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ ... Honestly if the roles were reversed, Zelda would have a ton of questions. She can hardly fault this person for their curiosity. This is extremely weird. ]

Yes, I shall have to go over their advice very carefully.

In the meantime, I suppose there is no harm in asking your questions.

[ It's not like she has to answer them, right? ]

text; id: ramuhs

[ramuhs]

[You know one of the best parts of coming into something like this late is 1) most of the questions are answered 2) and in a way that you can figure things out whereby 3) you can just ask the real question that now everyone is wondering:]

So when is your "second" wedding? If you need another officiant to make this one more official, I will gladly render my services 😉

[Also he is totally pinging Darin with this if privately since alas he doesn't know who the lass he's smitten over is, but this is fun.]

Text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ Most of the advice she's received has been... less than helpful, but at least those people tried to help. (That's what she's telling herself at least.)

This response? This makes Zelda consider throwing her shellphone into the sea. ]

THANK YOU FOR YOUR KIND OFFER, BUT I AM STILL IN THE PROCESS OF RENDERING THE FIRST ONE LESS OFFICIAL.

[ If nothing else, Zelda has learned about capslock. ]

Anonymous text

[telepathicignorance]

I'm with Sherlock on this one. You weren't the people getting married, just a way for them to make it happen.

(Things they don't ask: so did the ghosts use their bodies for the other stuff that happens with weddings? They're not sure they actually want to know the answer.)

Pretty sure if that weren't the case there'd need to be a lot of trials for attempted murder. (Because the ghosts were making people do that too.)

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

[ Yeah, Sherlock's interpretation does seem to hold water (weird as it is to think of herself as an outfit that a ghost wore). So Zelda ends up honing in on the other thing Anon says. ]

Attempted murder?

[ Maybe Zelda should count herself lucky that the ghost that possessed her wanted to get married to her former lover, not murder him for abandoning her. ]

{Text; UN: crescentmoon}

[prince_of_the_moon]

Why would it be binding if you were not yourself?

text; Anonymous

[multidisciplinary]

Because the legal definition is a bit complex. A marriage binds two people body and spirit, which under normal circumstances is not an issue. But in this instance, it was my body and another's spirit. Is my body bound in wedlock even though it was the spirit who spoke the vows? That is what I seek to determine, and thus far most of the answers given to me have been [ honestly kinda terrible ] less than definitive.